Ever felt like a square peg in a round-hole world of corporate structures? Julie Goff, the COO of HireBrain, joins us to unravel the tapestry of intrapreneurship, illustrating how it's not only possible but vital to kindle the flames of innovation from within. Our exchange traverses the landscape of workplace creativity, revealing how it thrives beyond artsy confines and how women, in particular, can harness it to fuel their career trajectories. We're peeling back the layers of standard corporate culture, advocating for environments that don't just tolerate but celebrate the entrepreneurial spirit that lies in each of us.
Have a question or comment? Email us at themanifista@gmail.com.
Portia Mount on LinkedIn
Tiffany Waddell Tate on LinkedIn
Julie Goff on LinkedIn
Julie Goff on Twitter/X
HireBrain
Ever felt like a square peg in a round-hole world of corporate structures? Julie Goff, the COO of HireBrain, joins us to unravel the tapestry of intrapreneurship, illustrating how it's not only possible but vital to kindle the flames of innovation from within. Our exchange traverses the landscape of workplace creativity, revealing how it thrives beyond artsy confines and how women, in particular, can harness it to fuel their career trajectories. We're peeling back the layers of standard corporate culture, advocating for environments that don't just tolerate but celebrate the entrepreneurial spirit that lies in each of us.
Have a question or comment? Email us at themanifista@gmail.com.
Portia Mount on LinkedIn
Tiffany Waddell Tate on LinkedIn
Julie Goff on LinkedIn
Julie Goff on Twitter/X
HireBrain
Welcome to season four of the Manifesta podcast, a career and lifestyle podcast for aspiring women. I'm Portia Mount. Join me and my co-host, tiffany Waddell-Tate, this season on our mission to help women find their purpose, lead high-impact careers and live fulfilling personal lives by sharing the stories of women who've carved their own path to success. The future is female. Let's get started. Well, hello squad.
Portia Mount:Our guest today is Julie Goff, chief Operating Officer at HireBrain. Julie is an entrepreneur turned entrepreneur, with a career at the intersection of people and technology. She has led technology initiatives of varying sizes and scales at the enterprise level and zero to one launches, and throughout her work, she remains ever curious about how technology can help make us more, not less, human. I love the sound of that. Now you're probably wondering what is HireBrain.
Portia Mount:Hirebrain is a B2B SaaS platform uniquely designed for hiring managers to assist in the ever challenging work of planning roles, hiring talent, building efficient teams with accuracy and reliability, and if you are a people manager, you know how important this is. Hirebrain leverages AI to help enterprises create role specific profiles, effective and equitable job descriptions, interview guides and so much more. You can learn more about HireBrain at wwwhirebraincom and you can follow Julie on Twitter. We still call it Twitter, but we know it's X at Julia Pete Goff and LinkedIn at Julie Goff, and so you will also see these in the show notes, as always, so that you can both follow Julie and also take a look at HireBrain. Welcome, julie, so great to have you, thank you.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Yeah, Julie. So this episode is all about entrepreneurship at work, but I think it's important that we define what that means for our listeners. How would you describe entrepreneurship and what it means to you?
Julie Goff:Well, I love that question, and I first have to kind of laugh at the notion that we're having a podcast on entrepreneurship, because I came to that. I discovered that word relatively late in my career, relative to the work I was doing, so I don't know where I was or what I was doing at the time, but I just remember hearing it for the first time and having this like moment of like oh my goodness, there's a word that describes me, right, somebody gets it, and I did a little research this morning about the origin of that word and apparently it came about in the 70s, like I didn't even know, and so I just heard it in my travels as I was doing the work that I was passionate about, and I was like an entrepreneur. That is what I am. I love it. There's a word for me.
Julie Goff:I'm not just weird, but I think the way that I would define it and it's interesting and kind of reassuring that my definition matches up with, maybe, the way the world would define it but I think it's a person who is just naturally curious, right? We know that this is true about entrepreneurs especially, right? They just have that burning. Oh my gosh, this is a problem that I have to solve, right, I have to stop everything, and I think that can. Still, if you're naturally curious, that's going to show up no matter what environment you're in, right.
Julie Goff:And so I think if you're doing good work at a corporation and you're close to a business, a business with challenges, a business with potential, right, you're going to be curious, see ways that things can be done better. If you're a curious person, you're going to be curious outside of work as well, right, and you're going to start to connect dots and ask questions and think about things. And so I think an entrepreneur or somebody who's going to bring that curiosity to their day job is not going to be afraid to with the right respect, right, and posture, ask questions, think about how things could be done differently and then not be afraid to take on the doing right. I think it's easy inside of a larger organization where there are a lot of problems, to be grumpy, to complain, and that's that doesn't cut it for me, right. Like I think, if you're going to be an entrepreneur, you have to see where it's broken and be ready to help solve the problems.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:It sounds like being super curious and someone who is not just identifying problems and calling them out, but looking for solutions probably means that you come up with a lot of big ideas. You're probably on the cutting edge of innovation and just driving creativity at a really fast speed. So I'm wondering, when you think about harnessing that mindset inside of an organization, how does it contribute to company culture and how does it contribute to your career right, especially as an ambitious woman?
Julie Goff:Yeah, so at any big organization, I think, especially early in your career, as you're sort of getting into the business, learning the company, learning how to do what you do, there's this sort of idea that the C-suite has it all figured out right.
Portia Mount:They do not. People, they do not.
Julie Goff:The board is going to lead us on a flawless path to growth. Right, and especially when you get into those leadership positions and you realize how little we know. Right, leadership is making the best decisions in the moment with the information that you have. Right, and being sort of courageous enough to keep going. And I think as entrepreneurs we can be the people that have the creative space right, the energy, to look at these problems and think about them creatively, because our C-suite often is dealing with so much you know they're living in kind of that cognitive poverty state.
Julie Goff:That's not good for creativity, right, and that's just reality. Right, if you're leading the company, you don't necessarily have the bandwidth, the time, the ability to take a step back and sort of think creatively and tinker. So, as an entrepreneur, right, the day to day is off your shoulders. You can look sort of with fresh eyes at problems and sort of bring that creativity, that innovation to a particular problem. And I think I like the word mindset, because that means lots of people have to be thinking that way at the same time. Right, and I think companies are going to take that step forward when you have a lot of people thinking that way across a lot of different problems and areas of the business. Right, it can't just be kind of the one person coming in with the savior, you know, complex or whatever and trying to fix everything that's broken. All of us have to be curious and creative at the same time, so I think that's where the mindset is crucial.
Portia Mount:I really want to dig into the mindset piece more, Julie, because, as someone who spent many years in corporate America, one of the things I've noticed is that I call it the not my circus, not my monkey's attitude. It's like. It's a survival mechanism, right Of like. Oh my god, I just need to do my job. Let me not get involved in like. There's no shortage of challenges or problems inside of companies, and that's also massive opportunity for the right kind of person, and you have to have this mindset that you're talking about. Of like. It's not just finding problems, but also thinking about how you can create opportunities. I would also add create value, right, Because not every problem that's out there is worthy of being solved, and so the question really is how do you, is that from your standpoint? Is there a blueprint or steps that one might think about to identify those challenges and turn them into opportunities? Even just thinking about your own experience, Somebody who's early in their career might be like oh, that's great, how do I do that? What kind of practical steps can someone take?
Julie Goff:Yeah, I often think these things start very small, right. Like if you see an opportunity on your team where something's broken and you can bring maybe a new piece of technology to your team, that's going to say we're going to work harder I mean, we're going to be smarter on this issue, not harder, because look at this piece of technology that I found that's fantastic, it's going to solve our problem. And then I think, once you do a few of those right, you gain trust you yourself, especially as women, right. Like I think we have to build our courage right, and I love kind of one of my mottoes is like courage begets courage, right. So I think you probably coach women this way too. Like you got to take that little step and put yourself out there and oh, ok, I didn't die, nobody fired me, ok, nobody died, nobody died, nobody died, nobody died.
Portia Mount:I am not doing surgery on anybody Now you, it's like it's yeah.
Julie Goff:I love that. That was one of my favorite moments in my corporate career was we were like on a conference call like 6 PM on a Friday night and everyone was frustrated. We couldn't figure it out. And somebody it was like this woman from Boston and she was like you know what? Everybody go home get a drink. Nobody's on the table bleeding out. We can figure this out. On Monday I was like levity always get, I love that it just it puts it in perspective really quickly.
Julie Goff:But I think it's that notion of kind of building your own confidence and courage, right, and again knowing that, like the higher ups don't have it all figured out. So your original ideas are good, right. And then I think it's also testing out if you're in the right environment where that's going to be embraced or rewarded right Because. I think I say this from experience. If you are in a situation where you're trying to be creative, curious, bring ideas to the table and nobody's having it like you're going to burn yourself back so fast.
Julie Goff:Fall back, Fall back right, I know, and you kind of have to, like, in a corporate environment you're going to hit some natural resistance just because of how big you know it's a big organization, right, a lot of big shift to turn.
Julie Goff:So you kind of have to take the long game approach. I think, if you're an entrepreneur in a lot of respects but you know the difference, right, you know the difference. If you're in a place where your ideas are absolutely unwelcome, or if you're OK, did a good job on this, let's give it the next thing. And I think, if you're driven like this, if you're an entrepreneur at heart, like if you can't turn off that curiosity and you're in a place like that, go see Tiffany and find your next role, because it's maddening, right, You're going to drive yourself nuts. And then, conversely, if you find yourself in a place where that is embraced, wow, like you are just energized and excited and building those muscles and seeing what's possible, right. So I think those are. That's really kind of the blueprint I would think about right, the small to the next, to the big, to the big, and then the ultimate is like entrepreneurship, right, I love that.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Yeah, julie, I am curious when you talk about context where it hasn't been welcome or it hasn't been encouraged to be curious and work in this way. What are some indicators that the place or the space does not have the capacity for that type of mindset, and can you share a time where you saw this show up in your career and what you did about it?
Julie Goff:Yeah, I mean, I think for me I have joke, but it was true, like for me, kind of the aha moment was like I started to get in trouble and I mean, obviously I'm a rule follower, I hate breaking rules, but I think if you're a creative sort of like person with ingenuity inside a big organization and if you're younger in your career right, and you have ideas sometimes, that's welcome. But if you're in a place that it's not welcome, you're gonna get your hands slapped and that does not feel good. No, and so I sort of joke. I was like I realized it was time for me to go when I started getting in trouble, because I wasn't doing anything wrong, but I just had too many ideas for the spot I was in, and so I think that that's probably a good indication For me.
Julie Goff:I experienced some of this when I was in banking in the mid 2000s, right, and that was a time where the financial crisis was hitting the economy, was taking like fear was the only emotion that we had inside of a bank at that time, right, and so I think we all are gonna be inside companies where our industry hits certain road bumps, et cetera, and fear is just like from the top down, fear is just gonna be everywhere, and so that is usually a time when creativity, curiosity, is just you can't speak up, right, you just kind of have to put your head down into your work.
Julie Goff:So I think for me, I in that situation realized I needed to like just put my head down and do my work, you know, but big picture as kind of that, that time sort of started to lift and things were getting better and I was thinking about my next move, like I think I realized, okay, I need to be in a place, whether it's inside a corporation or somewhere else, where I can be, have more freedom to move and to execute on these ideas.
Portia Mount:I wonder also, julie, you gave the example of being in banking highly regulated industry If you're working in pharmaceuticals again highly regulated and so I also wonder if the tolerance and then if you're at a legacy brand, if you're a? Tiffany and I both worked for a company that was almost 200 years old and had a long, long history, a very, very specific way of doing business as a Lean Six Sigma company. So everything's very standardized, very regimented, and understanding the environment that you're in and knowing that some environments don't like that's, let's say, creativity. And, by the way, we should probably talk a little bit about what do we mean when we say creativity? Because sometimes we think about it as being artistic, but that's not. I mean, creativity is actually very broadly defined.
Portia Mount:But I wonder and I've certainly seen this in my own career of really understanding your environment and figuring out where the boundaries are. And you're right, and I love you use the word, like when I started to get in trouble. And I wonder for those listening who are newer in their career, earlier in their career, it's like there are avenues, but you've got to understand the culture that you're in and I certainly know from experience that oftentimes there's that like you need to earn your stripes before you can run off and create other ideas. I will just say what I've seen with like especially, you know, our Gen Z team members. They're like I don't want to wait my turn, man, let me go. You don't let me do my thing, I'm going to go someplace else.
Portia Mount:That's legit. That's legit Absolutely. And you know, I wonder if we just spend a minute talking about just like. There are avenues, but you've got to understand the environment and the culture in which you're operating and then you can decide. You know what this, this place, isn't for me. I'm going to go on to the next thing, but I just wonder if you, if you know, if you have a perspective on that.
Julie Goff:I love that you said that, because it's so important, so important, and it actually reminds me of when I was graduating from college. There was this organization in North Carolina, a nonprofit, and I was just obsessed with the mission. I really wanted to go work for them. I think I interviewed with them for three different roles. None of that. I didn't get any of them, and I remember sitting across from a VP when I was, you know, 21, 22 years old, and she was like I love your passion, go get some skills and come back.
Portia Mount:And I was like this job will help me get the skills right now. We'll give me skills Hello.
Julie Goff:Yes, I know, I know it's funny. It's funny now.
Portia Mount:It's not funny, then I know right, it hurts, then it hurt back, then you can laugh now though.
Julie Goff:Right, that's great. And it immediately informed my my career path, right, I was like, okay, I'm going to go get a job. I mean, I'm in Charlotte, north Carolina, there's Wacovia, there's Bank of America, let me go, let me go get a job there. And it's not easy to get a job there, but that's what I started pursuing. I did get in there and kind of started my career there.
Julie Goff:Portia, I think what you said is absolutely correct, like that is a phenomenal place to cut your teeth, to get experience, to understand the unspoken dynamics of an organization, how to build relationships, how to have an executive presence right, I think all of those things are going to be so important later on. And you can't hone those skills by yourself, right, you've got to be inside an organization. And I think you, in those days, you have to have humility, right, you have to have the humility to say, like I'm just a kid, I'm just learning this business, right, but if you can put yourself in situations where you have to learn quickly, build those relationships, right, you're going to get so many reps on those skills.
Portia Mount:Yeah.
Julie Goff:Yeah, that you know I always said, like by the time I turn 30, I want to have amassed all these different skills that I can like okay, apply it anywhere. I don't know where I'm going, but I'm just going to have this sort of repertoire of skills. I also went to law school in my twenties at night, so it allowed me to sort of just have this like tool chest of things I could go use, and I knew that it would. It would equip me for whatever I was going to do next and wherever that passion led me, I was finally going to have the skills to bring to it.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:You know, Julie, when I, when I think about what you're saying, about capturing the skills, building your kind of word chest capabilities, let's call it that.
Julie Goff:That's what I'm saying.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:This idea of reading the tea leaves and making sure that your ideas and your passion, you're harnessing it towards something that is contributing value. I think, Portia, you said that earlier. That's always true and no matter what stage of your career you're in, it's like I can have a really good idea or I could see a quick solve to something, but is this quick solve sustainable? Does this quick solve help us drive more revenue? Does this quick solve mean we need to move some people around on this team because they're not going to make it once we implement this new way? You know like those are the hard question.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:It's like the what are the new problems that come about because we're solving this one? And I think, generationally. There's all this conversation about you know who's the smartest, who's the hardest working, and all this business. But the question is the same, regardless of your life stage or what part of the business that you're in, and so I think about. You captured all these skills, you leverage them inside of a big box organization, couple other organizations that were a little smaller, and then you flipped out into entrepreneurship. How has that work just been helpful for you now that you're in this space?
Julie Goff:Yeah, great question. Well, like I said, I came to that word entrepreneur kind of late in my career and once I found it and grabbed hold to it, the step to entrepreneurship was not that much farther right, because I kind of was able to like, frame and categorize everything I had been doing in a way that said oh, like I have the skill set, I am ready for this step. I don't think I mean. I know, tiffany, you and I know plenty of successful entrepreneurs in their twenties. We taught and mentored many of them. But like that wasn't me I know that wasn't me because I needed to go get skills, learn some things, develop that business acumen right, like all of those things right.
Portia Mount:Like my praise hands.
Julie Goff:Yes, I mean every, every criticism that somebody made of a leader during COVID. I said, nope, you don't get to criticize them because this is freaking hard. You know, there are so many competing priorities Like it is just hard to be. I was a leader at the time, took a new leader at the time portion Like you remember those like dark, lonely days of like what am I going to do? You know?
Portia Mount:we are. We were just out there trying to survive. We were literally, we were literally trying to survive.
Julie Goff:Yes.
Portia Mount:Yes.
Julie Goff:Yes, it was so surreal and it's like talk about we can look back and start to laugh now. But but now I mean, but then it was just it was scary. So I think experience gives you that acumen, gives you that appreciation for the complexity of things, but also, I think, just reminds you that you have to be able to step up and make decisions right, like you're not going to have perfect information, you're going to do your best to care for your team, but it's like they're going to get support from other places too. Right, and so I think you just gain a respect for sort of the things are not as easy as they might seem. You know it's easy to criticize when you're maybe earlier in your career. It's much harder to lead.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:You know 100%, and it's not easy to create products, but it's easier to create a product than it is to build the infrastructure for scale yes, With all the people that need to mobilize this organization, whereas you step into a company that 200 years old, it's well oiled, so they're challenged in there, but you're not creating that culture. So, yeah, it's a different set of skills. That's good.
Portia Mount:Yeah, julie, I want to pull on this thread of just the transition from entrepreneurship to entrepreneur, because I don't know that it's super intuitive per se. Was there an inflection point for you where you felt like, okay, I've done all I can do within the confines of a nine to five corporate structure and now it's time for me to now go and do my own thing? I like to joke that social media, twitter, llc, twitter will have everyone think they can build a billion dollar business like unicorn startup.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Right and the reality, you know like but we should all be building startups.
Portia Mount:if you just follow like seven or eight people on X, I'm sorry, x and you know, but the reality is and talk, and talk, oh my. God I forgot about. I forgot about LLC. Ted talk, you know, the reality is the entrepreneur. Streets are not for everybody. Some people need to stay on the sidewalks, and that's totally okay, and so it just was there a? Was there a moment or an event, or was it just a natural progression, Like what flipped the switch in your head, to say, okay, I'm just going to go for it?
Julie Goff:I love that question and I think it's an inflection point, or maybe several, that we all have to kind of like grapple with. I think for me. You know I was, I was working at Davidson College and I actually helped build out our Center for Innovation and Entrepreneurship. Tiffany got to see part of that.
Portia Mount:It's an amazing place, by the way, it's amazing place. Thank you, yeah.
Julie Goff:I think it's as an alumni and as as someone who helped create it, you know. So I think I think just swimming in those waters right starts to give you the bug a little bit. Also, when I left corporate America, I went to work for Davidson College. I had four roles in six years, which meant I wasn't getting fired, but I was always doing the next thing that the college needed done right. I sort of built a little reputation for myself, which was, I don't know, good or bad, but I think when I left corporate America I went to work for Davidson, I was going to lead a specific project. We had a $2 million grant. We had an idea to build an education technology project, and so what that did for me was like there's an idea, there's capital in the bank, now I just get to go build it right, that's that's like a startup.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:That's a dream.
Julie Goff:But I'm not doing it with with all the risks. So I feel like my career journey has been like I'm slowly taking off all the training wheels, you know. So by the time we we built Munch the Hub. I think that experience showed me I'm a builder, I'm not an operator. Right, that really became clear for me that I have to be building and creating Tiffany. This will probably not surprise you, but when I was at Davidson I did my Clifton Strengths Finder, which you are a huge proponent, yes, and my number one is achiever.
Portia Mount:So relatable relatable, yes, I'm sure we all have that. Yeah, it's like get it done. Get it done by any means necessary, and then onto the next, and then onto the next new thing. Onto the next new thing. Now we, you know we need someone else to optimize. So you know, you build and then you onto the next new thing. Let somebody else optimize. Yeah, yes.
Julie Goff:But I think that was the thing. And then I had someone else say to me kind of along that way, they're like you know, I just turned 40 this year and someone said, like you know, 35 to 45 are like some of your best working years, right, you've got experience, you still got energy, and like you want to build something. And I was like, well, I'm halfway through that, what am I going to do, you know? So I think that sort of gave me the permission to say, if not now, when, right. And I think it came from a place of like I'm going to do it, afraid, but I'm not going to live with regret because I tried it. I love that. Yes, all of us could go get a job, right, like, if needed, I could go get a job. But if not now, when? And if I want to look back on this part of my life and say, you know, I took the risks, you know, in a smart way, but I took the risks and I'm not looking back with regret.
Julie Goff:I think when you grow up in the corporate environment, you have a lot of friends who are still there. No, you know, it's not a bad place for everyone, but I think there are a lot of people that are there as they don't know where else to go. They don't know how else to like, parlay their skills or what else is out there. And these are, you know, at HireBrain, we talk about, like, your work is how you spend your day. Right, these are, this is your endeavor, these are the best you know, months, years of your life like. Let's be thoughtful about it. You know, and that's why we're passionate about hiring managers, because they play a huge role in that equation and don't always have the preparation to make good calls.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:I'm still thinking about whoever told you that you have the most energy 35 to 45, I want to know where they got the energy from, because I'm very tired.
Portia Mount:Well, and I'm saying and I'm over 45 and I have a ton of energy, of course, I have. I have a ton of energy as maybe the only over 45 on this here pod. So it does you know. But it's probably directly proportionate to how old your kids are or whether you have kids I hope it's not true. If you have kids, you are tired all the damn time. Let's just put it out there, that's right 100%.
Julie Goff:Well, it was. It was enough to like kind of get in my crawl and make me think about it differently. So, yeah, I think I think that was it, and I think I'll also say the other inflection point right, there's. There's the moment and I don't know if you all have experienced this, but there's the moment that we leave, right when we're like, well, I don't know what's on the other side of this, but we're leaving.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:And then there's the moment that you like settle in, right, yeah.
Julie Goff:And I think the settling in moment, honestly if I'm honest, it was more recent right when I'm like, okay, we've hit snags, we've had successes, we've had failures, but we're still around, we're still kicking, we're still winning. Business Like this is not perfect yet, but we're going to keep going. And you start to like feel that like we're settling in, we're doing the thing, as opposed to living on the roller coaster. Right Like, as an entrepreneur, you tie your identity, your financial security right To just like the day to day of a business, and that is unsustainable. So the settling in, the having kind of the like confidence to say like, even if it doesn't work out, I'll still be okay, that's a different inflection point and that's when I felt like I became a true entrepreneur. If that makes sense.
Portia Mount:Yeah, it makes a ton of sense.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:If there was one lesson, Julie, that you could give someone who's thinking about taking that leap, like having their leap moment, what would it be?
Julie Goff:You're never going to have all the answers that you want to have, like Portia, to your point, like, you're never going to be able to de-risk the whole equation. Right, it is a risk and so you're going to have to do it afraid, but it's also helpful to think about the worst that could happen. Right, I don't recommend anybody like you know, mortgage or help, like, do things as thoughtfully and as responsibly as you can, but there's still risk involved and even if it doesn't work out, you will still be okay. Right, I work with a lot of our customers at HireBrain, our enterprise companies, large, large companies, and we're working in the talent space, the talent acquisition space.
Julie Goff:So I'm also starting to hear all these stories about entrepreneurs who have gotten hired into corporations that used to be a faux pas. Right, like, you started a business. It failed, you know, we're just going to like, set you out to pasture for the rest of your life, and now I'm meeting people that are like running engineering divisions and like had a startup five years ago. Right, so, like, I think the experience is starting to be more like normalized into our culture and into our workplaces and so you're not risking everything. If you take the leap right. There is a path to go, I think, in and out of corporate America, your whole career, if you need to. Right, and that's becoming, I think, a career journey that's more common and people don't mind right, and as long as you keep those connections, and working as a startup with an enterprise is not that much different than working at a. I mean there are differences, but same skills, right, I'm still bringing the same skills to a startup, a vendor that's serving a global enterprise, as I would a leader in the enterprise, right?
Portia Mount:I will say, julie, though it's you know, having just I was just recently in tech and prior to that, industrial manufacturing, and we would often acquire companies that were run by founders, and one of the I thought the interesting observation that I found was that those found like it was great for the company, the acquiring company, but the founders invariably felt a little stifled by going, you know, especially if they had been in corporate environments before or had never experienced it and felt like, oh my God, like there's so many rules here and everything moves so slow and why?
Tiffany Waddell Tate:you know why do.
Portia Mount:I have to go through, like you know, three months of procurement to get a, you know, a pack of pencils and some post-its, and so I love what. I love what you say about, because I think it's absolutely true. Right, You're seeing more permeability between the sort of the walls of entrepreneurship, corporate and that culture. Fit sometimes works, sometimes doesn't, for the entrepreneur especially. And I'm curious if you've observed entrepreneurs feeling like you know what. This was great, I got a regular paycheck for a while, but let me go ahead and figure out how to get back outside into, you know, because I suspect, like the entrepreneurs that I know, once they've been on their own, they have very little desire to go and work. It's maybe it's the concept of working for somebody else and like putting in hard work for somebody else versus for themselves. I just want to give a perspective on that.
Julie Goff:Yeah, well, I think, I think in some ways, you know, our society has sort of glamorized entrepreneurship or startups or like you know the hockey stick growth, and the reality is like it's not for everybody, and so I. I think it's remarkable when people try it and say this isn't for me, I'm going to go back and bring my skill set to it. You know, like that's. That's a totally fine thing. Yeah, let's normalize that. Yes, yes, and these companies are getting remarkable talent as a result, right?
Julie Goff:If you run your own business and keep payroll going and keep keep the business capitalized and sell things like you are a better employee, whatever team you're running, when you go back to a corporation, right? So, normalize it all day long, hire those people all day long, yeah. But I think, portia, to your point, the people that truly have the bug, right, it's just like they're, they can never go back, right? Yeah, I just think those, those people will. They're going to, they're going to be the people that start two, three companies in their career right, and so I think that that's going to be.
Julie Goff:That's just going to be how they have to live their life. I think what I appreciate about our like my founder and I both spent, like my founder spent time at Oracle, cisco, so he, he has lived that life, he has run global teams, so it makes us so much better when we're sitting in front of you know enterprise executives, we know their struggles right, or at least we can relate right. We know what kind of what they're up against, we can speak that language and then I love that we get to work with the entrepreneurs at those companies, right, yeah.
Julie Goff:As a startup we're bringing the solutions that speak to the things they're trying to solve and they get jazzed. We get jazzed right, we get to work together. So I think, like being an entrepreneur who's been in that seat makes you far more prepared, I think, to bring good solutions, to speak that language and to really resonate with their struggles.
Portia Mount:So, julie, this is we get to like our most favorite. This is the most popular part of the pod, or is the lightning round, and are you ready?
Tiffany Waddell Tate:I'm ready.
Portia Mount:And so this is a. This is a lot, tends to be a lot of fun for our listeners and so question. So we talked about mindset the outset of this conversation. Is there a favorite motto or phrase that you have that defines your mindset?
Julie Goff:Yes, it was the motto that I shared earlier about courage begets courage.
Portia Mount:Yeah, I love that.
Julie Goff:I love that. That's been true, true for me. And like we don't get to big things overnight, like we've got to learn to trust ourselves, and I think, as women, we think courage is, you know, big, massive, grand things, and I think courage actually happens in the smaller moments, you know.
Portia Mount:So important, so important. It's a good reminder. We feel like we need to make quantum, but sometimes it's the incremental that is equally powerful. I love that Totally.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Okay, next question You're accepting a huge award. What is your walk on song? I love this song.
Julie Goff:I'm a huge music fan, but mine would be the beginning of Nine to Five by Dolly Parton, or it's like you know, and I don't know if you know all this, but the percussion that she does in that song are her fingernails on the keyboard. No, I had no idea. Yes, that's how. I I didn't know that she came up with that, because if you listen to the song, it sounds like someone, just kind of like.
Portia Mount:I learned something new.
Julie Goff:Oh, my God.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:I just thought that was like a ball and movement.
Portia Mount:I gotta go back and listen to this now. This is gonna be great. This is gonna be great for, by the way we're putting, we're gonna have a Spotify playlist of all these songs, so I'm just super excited about this. This is why.
Julie Goff:I had no idea.
Portia Mount:And.
Julie Goff:I have a coffee mug that's called Cup of Ambition. So Dolly really gets me energized. I, you know we loved her. I have to say we love Dolly Parton.
Portia Mount:We love us some Dolly Parton. She is like a phenomenal person. I don't know if you saw her recently she did like a guest thing with the Dallas Cowboy cheerleaders and she had like a whole little Dallas Cowboy cheerleader. We will have to link to that in the show notes, because she had on the full outfit it was. It was pretty amazing, I love me some Dolly, I love her.
Julie Goff:She was doing the thing she was doing, it she continues to.
Portia Mount:I think she's like 77 years old, so she's a goddess and I learned something new about her, which is even a double bonus, okay, julie. So here's the next question what book do you find yourself gifting or recommending repeatedly? We are big readers, the squad reads a lot, and so I'm super curious about this what do you read, what? What do you? I came prepared with props. Yes, I love that.
Julie Goff:Oh, my God, I love this book, but I haven't.
Portia Mount:I haven't read it yet. Somebody recommended it to me, so I just bought it. I love that and I haven't read it. Okay, I'm going to read it over the break.
Julie Goff:Scouts honor, scouts honor. Okay, I'm totally doing it. So, for those who are listening, so for those who are listening, this is called. It's called designing your life. It's a few years old, so it's been around for a while and it was written by the two professors at Stanford that really took kind of the the Stanford D school design thinking and kind of really brought that to their. Oh, there you go.
Portia Mount:Tiffany you've got. Oh, I wish I could get up and go and grab my copy so we could all hold up our copies together.
Julie Goff:I love that we all own this book. That must be a lot of reasons I love it.
Portia Mount:Oh, but only two. But only two of us not me have actually read the book. So you know, I'm going to go read it, though I promise, tiffany and Julie, I promise. Sorry about that.
Julie Goff:So thinking about this idea of mindset, like these Stanford professors were applying design thinking to all of these business problems and social problems, right, and then they actually created a course at Stanford called I think it's designing your first year or something.
Julie Goff:So it's like helping use design thinking for Stanford students to chart their learning for the four years that they're there. And then they took it to the next step, which is like using design thinking to think about your life plan, and so I love how this sort of breaks down thinking about your future, your next step, into kind of that design thinking, experimentation mindset. So it's very actionable. Every chapter you read you then can do homework like a journaling exercise or something. And I think when we pick up career books or like inspirational books, sometimes it's just sort of you're supposed to glean the wisdom from somebody's story, right, which isn't a bad thing. But this is so actionable that, like when people, especially my female friends, when they're stuck in a career situation, I give them this book because it's so actionable for you, you will be unstuck by the time you finish this book.
Portia Mount:That is an endorsement.
Julie Goff:What an endorsement I know they're not paying me, I just. I've given this book away a lot of times.
Portia Mount:Well, they should, they should, Julie.
Julie Goff:Yeah, just send me more so I can give them away. But I think it's also something you could do every couple of years, right Cause our lives are not static, so it just I feel like it's and it's talking about how to build a life, not a career. I think, especially as women, we sort of get honed in on the career and then everything else kind of has to fit around it. At least, I think that's how we sort of begin our careers and then life happens. But I think this is helping you sort of proactively think about, like all elements of your life and kind of where you want to be, and so I highly recommend it. Excellent recommendation.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:All right, Julie. What is the best purchase under 150 bucks you've ever made?
Julie Goff:Ever? This is a hard question, recent. I'll answer it recently not to feel like stereotypical, but my Stanley has been amazing. I drink so much water.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Mine's not on my desk, but I also have one.
Julie Goff:I resisted the trend for a long time and then when the North Carolina summer hit where you're like I can have cold water all the time I gotta get one.
Portia Mount:Oh my God, it keeps your water cold for like days. It's unreal. Tiffany told me about this Stanley cup and she was like, yeah, it's like this cup that influencers are talking about. And I was like that sounds totally stupid. And then I was like I was totally being derisive. I was totally derisive and judgmental and then and Tiffany would be like that Tiffany was like that's par for the course for Porsche. And then I was getting some stuff. I was at Academy Sports and there was like a wall of Stanley cups. I was getting stuff from my son and I was like, huh, well, maybe God, it's like 40 bucks. It seems kind of expensive, but all right, I'll get one. Oh my God, I am totally sold.
Portia Mount:Tiffany, I apologize to you in front of our squad in front of our squad audience, that I was wrong and you were right, Julie. Thank you, thank you. That's okay, I owe the same apology. Yeah, hook us up, stanley. Hook us up. We love your cups. Hook us up.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Yeah, Okay. What is a secret? Unpopular opinion that you hold.
Portia Mount:Okay, I cannot wait for you to answer this.
Julie Goff:I actually had a hard time with this question.
Portia Mount:No, this is like the most fun question. This is a safe space, julie? Tell us, tell us, I know.
Julie Goff:I think watching movies are a waste of time. What'd you say? I think watching movies are a waste of time Like I just can't. I can't sit down, I know, oh, I can't.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Any kind. What about inside out? What about inside out?
Portia Mount:It's very emotional, Tiffany, you can't just like start throwing out random movies Like, well, what about this movie? That is not the point of this. Tiffany is going to go. She's got a long list of movies that she wants you to like. Confirm or disconfirm that they're going to be on.
Julie Goff:Confirm that they're a waste of time, the reason I'm a podcast audible fiend, because I can like do other things while I'm listening, and that's probably more of a sickness Fair Than you know an attribute, but it is what it is. I am who I am.
Portia Mount:I love it and I love how you're resilient about that. You're like that's who. That's just who I am, that's just who I am.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:You can speed up audibles and pod to more efficiently get through them too. You can't really do that with a movie.
Portia Mount:Just diversion. I don't understand Cause Tiffany mentioned this, julie, that she will speak. You're like not the only person, tiffany, that will speed up a audio book so that they can listen to it faster, and I don't understand the logic of that at all. You don't have to explain it, I'm just saying I'm just putting it out there, not a lot, just like 1.2. Why? Why? I don't understand that, though. Like what is the logic To listen faster it?
Julie Goff:makes it shorter more. I just need to be multitasking, so if I'm walking the dog and listening to a podcast, I feel like I've got the double time going.
Portia Mount:You've got, so it's like a it's like your productivity hack. I will just tell you, julie, like I watch a lot of movies and I find myself watching the same movie over like several times, because I am multitasking and not paying attention to it, and my husband will be like haven't you watched this movie Like three times.
Portia Mount:I'm like, yeah, but I was doing like seven things and so, yeah, there's something to that, yeah, okay, so I love that is an amazing. I love that one. I'm going to really be curious about what the squad says says about this unpopular opinion, but I love it.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Okay, so you don't have to apologize.
Portia Mount:Own fully own your belief that watching movies is a waste of time.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Own it, embrace it, embrace it, embrace it.
Portia Mount:Okay, so last question for you is what is a hobby that you have that would surprise people who know you.
Julie Goff:This is also a little bit of a hard one, but I'm going to share the one that came to mind. So every summer, I host a series of backyard garden dinners at my house and hook us up next summer, come on, come on. But I also feel like just to kind of put a bow on our whole conversation. Like I started it in 2015 because I needed, like, a creative outlet, I invited 10 people over, I cooked a meal with local produce and I was like maybe I'll do this again, maybe I won't. Everybody loved it and they wanted me to do it again and it turned into a summer series. So I was doing three a year. I got a friend to come help me. Now we are up to four a year, 30 people per meal, per meal. I have a team of four that helps me.
Portia Mount:So this is amazing. This is totally amazing.
Julie Goff:I started small. I borrowed some tables, I got some bargain bin napkins at World Market, just threw it together, didn't spend a lot of money, and just like sort of iterated my way to something that now is a tradition that we love. Yeah, stealing this idea.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Okay, can I just say I've been following these harvest dinners on social At least. I know when you started and when I moved to my most recent home I told a friend I really want to get a huge outdoor table so I can have harvest dinners in my backyard like someone I know. And it was you, Like you've inspired me to do this.
Portia Mount:This is amazing.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:I think the idea of coming together at a table is top tier and I love that you've stuck with it and it's building community.
Portia Mount:Yeah, 100%. I love that too.
Julie Goff:It's allowing me the opportunity to be creative, but, at the end of the day, all my other skill sets project management, all those things help as well. But yeah, I think that was like something I'm really proud of, obviously, and something that's pulled a lot of different. I also think courage begets courage, but also creativity begets creativity.
Julie Goff:Right, if you put your creative thing out there 100%. It's just going to attract other people's creative things and I don't think everything well. So I want the person who makes bread to bring their bread. I want the person who loves music to create a playlist Right.
Portia Mount:I love this so much and cannot wait for my invitation to your one of your harvest dinners.
Julie Goff:All right, when you do this, I'm already inviting myself over Tiffany I love it Because I want to steal this idea, but I need to experience one first.
Portia Mount:I love it. No, in all seriousness, I love this concept. How cool, how cool 2024.
Julie Goff:Summer 2024.
Portia Mount:2024. Let's go, let's lock it in. Julie Goff, it has been such a wonderful pleasure to have you here on the pod. Thank you so much. We hope that we'll you'll come back and just thank you for all the wonderful insights on intrapreneurship. I hope that our squad you know one, I think just some of your wisdom around courage, around taking small steps, around the opportunities that it creates for career expansion, for learning, for growth and also, you know, sharing your a bit of your own journey. It's just been lovely to have you here today. We appreciate you so much.
Julie Goff:Oh, thank you and thank you all so much. I love what you're doing, thank you.
Tiffany Waddell Tate:Thanks, julie.
Portia Mount:And don't forget to follow us on Instagram at the manifesta and tip talk at the manifesta pod See you next time.